this post was submitted on 05 Jul 2023
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I miss playing MMO's, but micro transactions ruin any sense of progression for me.

Any mmo's out there that fit the bill?

Cosmetics are fine, as long as you can't just turn around and sell said cosmetics in game.

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[–] missquote@fedia.io 26 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Final Fantasy XIV would fit the bill. The cash shop only has cosmetics, and you can pay to add more retainers (basically bank space), but in terms of actual gold buying or power upgrades, none of that exists.

[–] ericbomb 7 points 2 years ago (6 children)

Hmm these look sus:

https://store.finalfantasyxiv.com/ffxivstore/en-us/product/804 https://store.finalfantasyxiv.com/ffxivstore/en-us/product/822 https://store.finalfantasyxiv.com/ffxivstore/en-us/product/809

Maybe they're not so popular, or in context not worth that much, but levels and money usually are no-nos for me. Because the one appears to be straight up levels and gil.

[–] ystael 26 points 2 years ago

This is a story skip. Many forms of character progress in FFXIV are gated by that individual character completing the main storyline quests.

A story skip boosts the character to the beginning of the current expansion tier, so it is not possible to use this mechanic to compete with standard players on current content. I think the intended use case is alt characters (which are less necessary in FFXIV because you can play all jobs on one character, but many players still have them).

[–] Naate 16 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Yeah, they're a skip to endgame content. But they're not any kind of "instant win."

The couple types of pvp aren't tied to your character level, and the most difficult raid content is best run with a group that you practice with. If you've never played, simply grabbing the game and one of those packages isn't going to give you an immediate edge.

XIV is sort of a single player game with a bunch of coop boss fights.

And, not to be cliche, but you can play through the entire first two arcs (A Realm Reborn and Heavensward) completely free, with no real limitations. The only things locked out of the free tier are the more social aspects, and any content above level 60. A handful of jobs are locked, but there is a ridiculous amount of content available for free.

I've played a few other mmos and hated them all. XIV is something weirdly different. And the overwhelming majority of the community is chill and friendly.

[–] TassieTosser@aussie.zone 12 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'd argue that if you never played, then getting one of those packages would actually make you play worse than someone who's played from the start.

[–] Naate 3 points 2 years ago

I agree, 100% The only people I know who bought them were for alts they had in other data centers. Skip the grind they've already done so they can jump in the with static they joined.

[–] MacaroniLove@lemmy.ca 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Leveling up in Final Fantasy XIV is easy. Just play the story and you'll reach max level by the time you finish it.

These items are intended for players who create an alt and who wish to skip most of the stury if they already played it.

Also reaching max level is kind of where the game begins (raids, dungeons, gearing up, etc).

Also 500,000 Gil is pocket change...

[–] liminis 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Would disagree it's where the game begins, given how story-directed it is. FFXIV is, to me, a single-player JRPG in the shell of MMO combat with a huge amount of multiplayer content. (Especially with the fulfilment of duty support allowing you to do MSQ dungeons with bots.)

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[–] Templa 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I play FFXIV since 2014 and I honestly wouldn't recommend anyone to buy this. You're just paying to not play the game and skip the main quest (which locks up a bunch of content behind it).

[–] liminis 2 points 2 years ago

Worth actively recommending against, even.

[–] forbiddenlake@fedia.io 5 points 2 years ago

Also: the included gil is a small amount. It's meant to replace the gil you'd earn from doing the story quests.

[–] buckykat@lemmy.fmhy.ml 3 points 2 years ago

I forgot those exist because what kind of monster would pay to skip the story the story is the best part.

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[–] Didros 17 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It is not a normal suggestion because the base game is probably the most pay to win mmo that has lasted more than a year or two. But both versions of Runescape (both old school and Runescape 3) have a game mode called ironman mode.

Ironman mode is an official account type that you can create where you can not trade other players items or money. Everything is earned and gathered yourself. If you want to make a bow you need to gather the flax to spin a bow string and chop logs to fletch an unstrung bow and then string it.

It is a slower mmo with most skills in the game having methods to train where you don't need to pay much attention and you can mostly watch youtube.

Both games also have very mechanically different and difficult combat encounters you can work your way up to.

Maxing out every skill in the game takes year(s) to do and there are hundreds of incredibly unique quests that in my own opinion set the bar for mmo questing. There are no kill 30 boar quests or fetch quests (really) they are mostly very in depth stories with character archs and so much lore if you are into that.

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[–] shakesbeare 17 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Really think you should give FFXIV a deeper thought beyond just looking at the store and finding the level skips.

Even if you were to buy a skip, there’s still a considerable amount of game in front of you to play. They are only meant to get people to modern content without having to (to some people) slog through hundreds of hours of older stuff. It’s not a p2e micro-transaction by any means — far from it.

[–] Vestria 11 points 2 years ago

I agree with this whole-heartedly, there's simply no way any reasonable person would consider skipping story content as buying power in the context of how FFXIV works as an MMO.

It lets players jump right into the new content without worrying about dozens or hundreds of hours of prior story they may or may not want to play through to get to the latest content at the same level as everyone else starting out, that's all.

[–] ericbomb 3 points 2 years ago

Hopefully you understand why I was a little suspicious!

But I tried it out, and holy moly it feels like a different era. My brain can't compute the fact that I just got a free to play game (Just have the demo, which honestly sounds like a ton of game) and it's not trying to sell me anything in game? The tutorial was all about game play in universe, and never once told me about premium currency? My ui doesn't have 5 different things? Crafting doesn't involve long cool downs that I can 5 gems to speed up?

Like it feels like a different era of game, thank you for being persistent! I've only played a couple hours, but so far it feels like it's going to become a comfort game at the very least.

[–] liminis 3 points 2 years ago

Absolutely, it's absurd to conflate XIV's level skips with being able to buy gold in other games.

XIV was actually my first thought re: the OP's query.

[–] brsrklf@compuverse.uk 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

They are only meant to get people to modern content without having to (to some people) slog through hundreds of hours of older stuff.

Counterpoint : if it was just that, it'd be free.

[–] shakesbeare 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The money makers here want you to play their game. The more time you invest, the more money they make in subs. If you want to skip all that game and thus, in some ways, get all that progress done without having to pay all that sub, you’ve gotta fork over some cash.

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[–] NuPNuA@lemm.ee 15 points 2 years ago

Guild Wars 2 is the only one that ever really hooked me. Didn't find any pressure to spend in that to keep up, that said I haven't played it in a while so it may have changed.

[–] pixel 14 points 2 years ago (5 children)

Guild Wars 2 basically makes it impossible to buy power -- once you've purchased all the expansions, at least. Which is incredibly impressive considering there's an official way in-game to trade real-world cash for in-game gold.

That's one of the benefits of having gear be horizontal, you can get a build geared from a fresh account in a few days, and then there's only minor optimizations you can make (there's a gear rarity that's higher than the readily-accessible exotic gear but basically you have to earn it, and then there's legendary gear which is there for fashion and qol because you can change the stats on it at any time).

[–] archaeoraptor 7 points 2 years ago (3 children)

There's other quality-of-life upgrades available in the gem store (real world money store) like infinite gathering tools and inventory expansions. That's what I spent my IRL money on. But yeah, not really accurate to call that a "power" improvement.

Can you buy fractals infusions or other equipment upgrades with gems or gold, or do you have to acquire them through fractal dailies? I never had enough friends to do the fractals content.

[–] artichoke@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

You can buy agony infusions which are required for higher tier fractals but they're so cheap in gold no one should spend real world money on it and you'll earn it naturally if you're climbing the fractal ladder normally. A lot of guilds even give away the agony infusions if you are struggling to gain them. I recommend trying fractals at T1 even in LFG, you'll usually find other new players to fractals who are willing and expecting new players to it, but it won't hurt to watch a video if you're nervous

Gw2 really does a good job limiting power so you hit max power quickly that you really are just buying convenience.

This is pretty much only possible because most actual power is account bound and as you can hit near power cap so quickly, you're generally skill/knowledge bound instead of power bound

[–] pixel 2 points 2 years ago

You can buy fractal infusions with gold for sure, but if you progress through fractals at a normal clip you'll also be able to just make them for yourself. It just expedites things or lets you more efficiently gear other characters, but that's severely overstating how easy it is to get infusions on other characters once you have enough to do t4s and CMs. They aren't dropped by dailies per se, but you DO get them while completing dailies. You can also technically buy infusions in the TP that are stat boosts for gold, but that's literally like. 500 dps out of 40k, at most. it's pretty trivial and stat boost infusions are only really useful for people doing benchmarks

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[–] ono@lemmy.ca 12 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (3 children)

Palia might not be the kind of game you're looking for, but it is an MMO in development, and has this to say on the matter:

  • Palia will monetize cosmetic items
  • Palia will not monetize things you earn through gameplay

That, along with the rest of their messaging, reads to me like they don't plan to make it a pay-to-win game.

[–] mifan@feddit.dk 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I have been so excited for Palia since it was first announced. It looks so cozy and chill.

[–] ono@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago

I'm excited, too. It looks like a breath of fresh air for gaming with friends. I hope it hits the spot.

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[–] TassieTosser@aussie.zone 9 points 2 years ago (3 children)

FFXIV.

Not sure about ESO and SWTOR. I know WoW has the token market that technically counts as turning money into power by selling tokens and buying clears.

[–] Mithra 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

SWTOR definitely has purchasable power, since you can sell cosmetics from the real money store on the ingame auction house for ingame currency. With that, you’ll be able to buy gear enhancements on the auction house, that are required for endgame (VM operations, etc.)

[–] ericbomb 3 points 2 years ago (4 children)
[–] troyunrau@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 years ago

Story skip. Basically only journalists use them when there's a new patch and they can't invest the time before they review the next patch. Very few gamers use them.

[–] fushuan@lemm.ee 3 points 2 years ago

Story skips are to be honest detrimental for the player because you suddenly don't know who the fuck any of the core NPC are, you have not bonded with them, and you are doing crazy shit with them. You miss out most of the story beats that make FFXIV worth playing.

In any case, about raid content, it is expected to be max level of an expansion within the week, being able to buy a skip to the beginning of the current expansion doesn't influence that at all because most players will already be there when the expansion launches.

The most PTW thing I can see in ffxiv is the ability to buy retainers who farm some stuff for you to have a very minimal edge in gold, but you get a free retainer and I've not sent it to farm because hold doesn't mean anything in this game tbh. Even if you want to get an edge with gold this again is super low tier because the only "competitive content relevant" thing you can buy is crafted gear than other players put in the marketplace, and usually if you play regularly you would naturally have enough gold to buy it anyway. The best ILVL items can only be unlocked through content.

[–] shakesbeare 3 points 2 years ago

As others have said, the story skips are kinda awful.

Plus, I gotta say that it doesn’t really make a difference. They don’t give anyone an advantage over anyone else and don’t impact the way you experience the game at all. If you don’t like them, just don’t buy them.

At worst, you’ll run into some guys who are really bad because they skipped a huge portion of the game to get to modern content. But it doesn’t give them any edge over you by any means.

Again, I can’t stress enough how these affect other players 0%.

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[–] HatchetHaro@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Some of the best gear in ESO come from their paid DLCs and Chapters. Technically locked behind a paywall, but you'll still have to farm the gear yourself.

The microtransactions themselves only offer cosmetics, consumables (that aren't more powerful than the craftable options), and utility stuff (race-change tokens, and skipping some of the skillpoint grind).

There is a player market for exchanging Crowns (microtransaction currency) for gold, and another player market for buying raid clears with gold. Raiding (called Trials) offer some of the best PvE gear. You don't need to buy clears if you're skilled enough to run those Trials and can find groups to do it with you.

If you just want to enjoy the game without worrying about min-maxing your build, all the base-game and craftable options will do you just fine.

[–] recnamoruen 9 points 2 years ago

If the game has any way to trade, it's possible to buy power. Wow Classic or Guild Wars 2 are probably your only really options.

[–] Thebazilly@pathfinder.social 6 points 2 years ago (3 children)

I haven't played in ages, but Guild Wars 2, maybe? It was my favorite MMO for years.

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[–] Phroon 5 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (8 children)

Clan Lord. It’s a place that’s special in my heart. I’ve been playing on and off since 2001.

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[–] artichoke@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

I agree with guild wars 2 (and guild wars 1) just like what the other commentor suggested

But old school RuneScape iron man mode does this as well in a different way by blocking you from the auction house and trading so you can't buy anything and you must earn it all yourself

[–] zauberin 4 points 2 years ago (5 children)

FFXIV, RuneScape (either one, personally recommend 3) if you do Ironman

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[–] termus 4 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

City of Heroes - After its shutdown in 2012, player ran servers finally popped up in 2019 after the source code leaked. The most populated server, Homecoming has the Pay2Win vendor with everything from the store in it for free or for influence (in-game currency). Nothing really gives you a huge advantage though.

Ultima Online: Outlands - A free server heavily modified from the base game running on ClassicUO with some extra features. Completely new continent that they are still adding to and updating. To me it feels like an alternate reality where they actually gave a shit about UO. You can donate to the server and receive Prevalia coin, which can be used to buy cosmetics. It can be converted into gold by selling it to other players, but you won't get an insane amount (1 prev = about 18k and I can farm 15k in about 20 minutes if not faster).

[–] essellburns 3 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Starwars: The old Republic.

Totally free for eight excellent epic stories with no pay wall to overcome or excessive difficulties without subscriber benefits.

Subscription unlocks more content.

Microtransactions are for cosmetic only, and there's plenty of cosmetic options without them too.

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[–] king_dead 3 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Runescape was like that for the longest time and tbh k dont think bonds really impact my experience all that much

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[–] onTerryO@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 years ago

Lord of the Rings online might. Ton of content is available for free. The story and world are excellent especially if you are a Tolkien fan.

[–] buckykat@lemmy.fmhy.ml 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

FFXIV's cash shop is cosmetics only and those cosmetics are non transferrable as far as I know. I've certainly never seen anyone selling cash shop cosmetics for gil.

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[–] ericbomb 3 points 2 years ago

This is probably one of 3 suggestions that actually fit, so I'll try it out!

[–] ozoned 2 points 2 years ago

Project Gorgon. Very old school, skill based, indie game, buy the box and you can pay for premium if you want.

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