Asklemmy

What should I have said?

"You think about strange men's genitals a lot, don't you?"

I don't get why we have different bathrooms at this point. Its more efficient to just have them all be family bathrooms with floor to ceiling stalls.

Nothing.

Nothing is good enough. Gendered bathrooms are about repression. That's why they are so mad about non-gendered toilets that are popping up.

"Counter question: What stops a creep from doing that even if there was an anti trans law?"

Reminder that this is not a thing that has ever actually happened.

What should I have said?

"Wow, sadly I think it means that person has some serious mental issues, and we should get them some help.

Are you feeling okay? Do you want me to call someone for you?"

Uhhhhh there are no urinals in the ladies so everyone is in a stall? So?????

Does this fella want the ladies to shoot him?

(Using the ladylike Darringer from her pocket book, saying "ah do declare" of course)

i've understood that coed bathrooms have existed in various places in the country long before republicans decided they were going to create a campaign against transgender people using restrooms. Grow up. Everyone poops!

Is there no one in the replies here who thinks women have a legitimate discomfort, or unsafe feeling, having men around in a toilet space, even if the men aren't actively being harmful?

No women here who had difficult upbringings with men? No men whose daughter or sister or female friend feels uncomfortable letting certain barriers down around strange men?

Of course there is an important discussion about how bathroom culture changes as society's acceptance of trans people changes.

But, OP, I think what you would do best beyond what you said, is to acknowledge that some women have a legitimate concern, even if there's not an easy answer. Once you have that point of agreement - once the other person can see you care about the concern they're coming from - you have a foundation for discussing a real problem and/or solution.

Otherwise you're just buttimg heads to win, and asking an internet echo chamber to adjudicate.

The argument made by the person asking that question is not based on any realistic fear they have actually thought through. On the big list of gendered violence, a cis dude saying they are trans to accomplish... being present in a bathroom without themselves getting harrassed... doesn't even register.

Instead, this is just a typical attempt to punch down based on an imagined danger, usually on someone else's behalf. There's nothing an oppressor likes more than a piece of illogic that frames their target of oppression as, sneakily, the real oppressor. In this case, it is trans people wanting bathroom access without having to out themselves or to otherwise just not contradict their gender. Gender neutral bathrooms would also be acceptable, or even better, but cis people have insisted on gendered bathrooms. Rather than say, "yeah trans people shouldn't have to put up with that cis bathroom bullshit", reactionaries try to come up with ways to reframe the ask as its own form of oppression. This is also the mainstay of TERFs, basically just cis women that pretend trans women are oppressing them by wanting basic equal consideration.

Depending on who this person is, you may want to try various tactics. If you think you can be flippant and dismissive of them, definitely do that preferentiallu. Make them feel like they are being ridiculous and that if they really care about violence against women they should work on guaranteeing housing for all and hate cops. If you can't be flippant, I recommend still not taking it seriously but just changing the subject to the actual act of oppression and telling them more or less what I said in previous paragraphs. All of this assumes this us a person whose mind you want to change, like that of a friend or family member. If it is a colleague, start documenting their transphobuc comments and see if anyone else has your concerns, get their documentation as well. If it is just some rando, just tell them to shut the fuck up with bad faith transphobia and move on.

This is not even a good question to argue with, if anyone in the restroom is being a creep it's not ok and that's that.

We're assuming that you're talking to someone who's willing to have a discussion in good faith.

You'd first need to know why that isn't a sufficiently solid answer. Are they looking for a perfect solution? Because I'm pretty sure there isn't one. What we want is an improvement over the status quo, and sometimes an overall improvement necessitates a worse experience in certain areas.

ask them what happens when a guy walks into a women's restroom and says they're a trans-man but is lying and isn't actually trans?

and what is stopping a cis male from doing the same?

Whatever you answer to a question like that is going to be attacked. The best way is not to answer, but reply with a different question, for instance "what are you afraid of?"

I'd say the best answer to this conservative is that it's like open carrying a handgun. Just because someone is carrying a handgun doesn't make them the bad guy, so you leave them alone.

But if they draw that weapon and threaten someone, you call the cops.

..or another good guy with a gun?

You've said your opinion. The asker asked. They got their answer. End of story.

You know I still don't understand the issue people have with this. Every bathroom I've been in either has stalls to use with urinals on the side and dividers between those for some privacy, or is only designed for one person at a time anyway. I can't imagine having any issue with anyone of any gender in those types of bathroom, unless they where being clear creeps and trying to press an eye to a gap in a divide or something. Which isn't solved by limiting the genders who can enter, it's solved by building better dividers and not leaving gaps.

This isn't Rome my dude, we're not all sitting in one room and having a face to face while we clart.

That is a solid enough answer, you were just trying to have an adult conversation with someone who has outsourced their thinking to someone who wasn't involved in the conversation. To convince them, you would have had to find their thought leader and convinced them that it is to their advantage that their thrall believe the thing you believe.