I agree that this is a cool idea, but I also wanted to note that these kinds of labour trade systems remain inaccessible to many people with disability, as well as to single parents, carers, and other people who are time poor.
this post was submitted on 14 Jun 2023
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Betterment and Praxis
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Thats true which is why we still need our usual safety nets in society like subsidised childcare, respite care, and disability benefits. This wouldn't replace normal society, it would just add to it. I would love to see increases in those areas as well as a timebanking system for those who are interested and able to participate. It's all about doing what you can, even if that's just sitting and chatting with a lonely someone so I think it could be something pretty disability friendly compared to the corporate work world.
Fwiw as a PwD it doesn't feel or look very disability friendly. I'm not dismissing the whole initiative, though, I just wanted that to be part of the conversation.
I just tried to post this but it didn't show up apologies if this is double posted.
Oh also, my own preferred systems of community organising is standard mutual aid along the lines of "to everyone according to their needs, from everyone according to their abilities". I get that it feels like nitpicking but it does kind of hurt as a PwD to see these kinds of initiatives (and, e.g., trade unionism specifically) be discussed, knowing that we don't really fit into the framework and that just never really coming up.
I think people engaging with their local communities is great though and I'm not trying to diminish that.
That's valid. Do you have any suggestions on how to make something like this more PwD friendly and feel more accessible? Part of the appeal to me is that not ever task needs to be a trades job or something highly skilled. I just read an article where an organisation (a hospital) "paid" time bankers in hours of language lessons and skilled job training for the members to help PwD and elderly community members. It's just another way to get more people volunteering in communities and fostering that connectedness but I absolutely want to keep from having PwD feel excluded from yet another corner of society.
I don't think PwD generally fit into skills trade or labour-oriented community organising structures. I don't think that means that those things shouldn't happen, I just think it is important for part of the conversation to be about the limitations of those types of organising structures and not just their merits (and they do have many merits!).
Thank you for bringing it up!
I'm disabled and like this idea. Obviously folks with disabilities aren't monolithic and I can't speak for everyone. Certainly there are more disabled than me. But I like the idea because it values time equally rather than valuing ability. Disabled folk are often relegated into shitty jobs with low wages because no one else wants those jobs and disabled folk often can't get traditional roles due to lacking the ablebodiedness to perform them. This way disabled folk can do anything within their ability and an hour of their time is just as valued as an hour of an able bodied person.
Could it use some improvements? Of course! But I think it's far and away a better system than what we have currently which not only devalues disabled folk but actively oppresses us.
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I'm interested to know what would prevent someone with a disability from being able to offer an hour of their time for a service which is within their skillset?
The single parent is a great example of being time-poor, but an example of something they could more easily offer is an hour of babysitting/playdate.
For me, my disability is MS and my most disabling symptom is fatigue and double vision that develops from fatigue (also heat and cold sensitivity...). I spend all my energy raising my daughter, and still don't have enough energy always to do that the way that I would like to. Honestly I am not sure where you're going with this question, but it feels like asking pwd to satisfy you that we have different capacities and it doesn't feel great.
Honestly I am not sure where youβre going with this question
Trying to gain knowledge, and you've provided something new which I didn't know about, so I thank you.
but it feels like asking pwd to satisfy you that we have different capacities and it doesnβt feel great.
If I may be honest, this struck me as a very strange part of your response. How can people learn or understand if they can't ask for help to learn?
How can people learn or understand if they canβt ask for help to learn?
There are actually lots of resources about this on the internet that you can look at rather than asking pwd directly to educate you, because it is exhausting and I get that lots of people have these questions, but also -- again -- there are many resources about it on the internet. It is both draining and isolating feeling as if you need to be constantly educating people around you and convincing them that you're not just trying to weasel out of working or whatever.
Hmmm... I don't think there are resources online for requesting a clarification on your original comment, other than asking you.
It's clear you haven't looked at all. It is not the job of pwd to educate people without disability, and I have tried to be polite about this.
Isn't this just small scale communism under a different name?
Nah it doesn't really have anything to do with property rights. I guess in the sense that each person contributes and receives according to their needs?
Fundamental issue.
You aren't paying a lawyer for an hour. You're paying a lawyer for the time they spent on schooling and practice that it took to reach their current level of skill. They also need to make up for the opportunities (financial and social) that they chose to forgo in order to become a lawyer.
Risk also matters for jobs, logging for example is way more dangerous than programming.
This is why we use currency as a proxy for time, so it can account for all these factors.
This isn't something to replace normal monetary currency, it's just another way to organise volunteering for willing participants! It's like an extension of doing odd jobs for friends to your wider community and a way to meet new people with different skillsets.
For example I do sewing and mending and my partner fells trees, cuts firewood, and helps with building projects for our friends and they help us with tree plantings and garden projects. We have a mate who helps with accounting stuff in exchange for hunting access. It would be what a lot of us already end up doing but on a slightly larger scale with a bit more organisation. It's definitely not for everyone but I think it would be neat to try.
You don't need a bank if it's volunteer anyway
It's a nice way to keep track and make it feel more equitable for some people. Give an hour get an hour π€·πΌββοΈ it's really okay if this isn't for you. It works for some groups but not others.
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