Can you please activate your webcams?
Please choose a sticky note color to use for this meeting
Please take one of these smiley stickers and tell the others how you feel now
this post was submitted on 17 Aug 2023
190 points (100.0% liked)
Programmer Humor
853 readers
15 users here now
Post funny things about programming here! (Or just rant about your favourite programming language.)
Rules:
- Posts must be relevant to programming, programmers, or computer science.
- No NSFW content.
- Jokes must be in good taste. No hate speech, bigotry, etc.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
I just recently learned what "scrum manager" is and it sounds like a cult of useless middle managers.
I started at a new company and have been filling a scrum master role until they find me a replacement and I can move to the position I was supposed to be hired for and honestly, its the worst job I've ever had. Its literally hand holding and baby sitting. Its terrible. I almost got pushed in front of traffic when I asked "why cant the engineers move their own boards...?"
Your company and mine seem to be very different. We have agile coaches, but they mostly organise cooperation and shoulder check our stakeholders if they try to scope creep some bullshit in.
We also have agile coaches but the way my team uses jira is not at all how its supposed to be used. They are basically forcing it on us and people arent thrilled so the agile coaches are trying to mold it to what they want but they dont want it. Its a whole thing. Im also not a scrum master, Im an engineer pretending to be a scrum master as well as doing my other work and our agile coaches are...clueless for lack of a better word. Jira works great for our other teams. Just not the team Im on.
Yeah, that sucks. Let's hope for better times my friend
Hey thanks I appreciate it. Like I said, just waiting for them to find a real scrum master for my team then I get to do my actual job but at least its pushing me into more of a "people skill" position. Trying to silver lining it haha
The temporary construct is the most durable of them all 😔
Scrum master = project manager.
Definitely not, Scrummasters should not be connected to the project at all. Their job goes directly against it, a PM is a stakeholder who will ask for everything to be done immediately, and needs to get stuff done. A Scrummaster should be neutral, and should uphold the process and defend the dev team.
Common scenario:
That right there highlights where a scrummaster should be working. Most companies do treat them as neutered dogs though, and don't give them the power. True scrummasters have the ability to push back on PMs and defend their teams, keeping developers out of it so they can stay heads down. (Less useless meetings)
A project manager should never be a stakeholder. A project manager should be managing expectations and pushing back against scope creep and ridiculous demands for immediate results as part of managing the project based on available resources and the estimates of the project team compared to overall progress. They will also address situations where different interacting parts need to be timed correctly, but that would also be the same responsibility of a scrum master, because they manage the project when using agile terms.
Most places treat project managers as neutered middle men who are implementing the will of the stakeholders, which is why so many end up being the terrible type that you are stereotyping project managers to be. Those same organizations will do the same thing to the scrum master or whatever name they give to the person who is supposed to be managing the project. You know, a project manager.
Probably right, in my experience you're describing a Product Owner, someone who is neutral on the business side who takes care of prioritization in a netural way vs a Project Manager, who does have requests, asks, and demands of the dev team
That sounds awful, I feel for you.
Having worked in a lot of scrum teams in positions ranging from Jr Dev to CTO, I have become a huge proponent of scrum masters.
And in my experience a SM becomes a full time position at about 15 devs.
Exactly right, scrummasters should be outside of the business and developer chain so they can uphold the process first and foremost. One of the phrases I hate the most is "we're in crunch time, we don't have time for process." No, that's when you need process the most! It doesn't matter if it's crunch time or whatever, PMs and business sometimes needs a reality check on what is possible and what isn't, and developers need someone in their corner that isn't also their manager.
From all of the replies it was to me that a Scrum Master can be very useful in specific projects that involve interplay between many departments. But in reality it seems like it's a way for companies to avoid creating clear job requirements.
Def a way underrated comment.
Wait, are you talking about a scrum master under a different name or an actual position above that?
Honestly, I just heard of the turn "scrum" the other day on an application, and after some looking into what that is, I came to the conclusion that it's the corporate version of a Liberal Arts degree. Not completely useless, but almost.
I'm sont have any influence on that applicant, btw, so I'm not influencing someone's life based on my half assed googling.
Well, from experience I can say that scrum and a (good!) Scrum master can really turn things the right way.
Even something as simple as being the impartial moderator can be invaluable, given the borderline-autists many developers are (won't even exclude myself there). A pointless 30min meeting can become a valuable sync up.
Apart from that a (again, good!) Scrum master can organize a lot of stuff away from the developer. The job literally means removing impediments and I've had the luck to work with one SM, who really took that seriously.
It's not a management position, btw. At least it's not supposed to be. It's supposed to be on the same level as the devs. Unfortunately (and that's the part where you are right), this position and scrum in general were churned through the corporate buzzword grinder so often, that it's almost meaningless now and often enough just means pointless meetings and pointless metrics (ironically measured in "story points").