Asklemmy

To be honest you probably won't save money as you'll be more likely to upgrade regularly. I bought my Framework 13-inch last year and already bought a gorgeous new matte screen for it, and I'd been eyeing upgrading the mainboard with the new AMD one now. In the past with laptops I'd hold onto them for years until they couldn't perform, and now I'm considering upgrading my device a second time within only a year?

I really do love my Framework, but the easier upgradability makes upgrading more likely, which means more expenses - unless you can restrain from upgrading more often than you would on a laptop. Since budget seems to be a concern for you this may be worth keeping in mind. On the other hand though, I'd be concerned about how long a $500 laptop will last you anyway (the ones I used for years were more like $1200).

One final thing - some parts can't necessarily be carried over when upgrading to a new generation. For example, to upgrade to the AMD mainboard I'll also have to buy new RAM as the generation upgraded to a newer variant. If I want to use my old mainboard as a home server, I'll also have to purchase replacement parts for what it loses in the upgrade (new hard drive, new expansion ports, cheap case). It's great if you had an existing need for a home server, not so much if you didn't. Since I hate throwing out electronics I'll end up buying more to keep it operational, even though in practice I won't use it very much.

TL;dr - Framework makes upgrading and reuse cheaper and easier, which if you're like me makes you spend more money and upgrade more frequently.

i was planning on getting a new laptop cheaply for about 500ish

You should plan for what you need, not for what you're willing to pay. If you need a mobile workstation then this 16 inch laptop would be too large and heavy. If you aim for a desktop replacement, then a 13 inch laptop might be too small (docking stations exist, but still ...).

The Framework laptop is a nice idea, though. But to be honest: how often did you change the components of your laptops before? One usually changes the SSD and maybe the RAM or the battery or - if you're really adventurous - the heatpipe and/or the fan. All of this is already possible with most common laptops. If you're unsure, get a ThinkPad.

For me the deal breaker is to wait for so long before getting it. They have to step up the production. I'm fine with waiting for one month and can understand. But, the actual waiting time is ridiculous.

I'm interested in a framework laptop for the environmental perspective, but I also think a pre-owned high end device would be faster and with smaller impact.

You can look online at what the upgrade parts cost. If you were upgrading to the AMD main board you're looking at $450-$700, versus $1200-1550 buying it new. The Intel i5 components are similar but i7 are a bit more expensive. Thus far they have been consistent about releasing upgraded components. You are locked in to buying from them though - so if they stop releasing upgrades you're out of luck.

If you don't need the latest and greatest, going used is going to still be a better value proposition.

It can be a long term investment in the same way a car is a long term investment - you can tune it up over the long term to extend it's life but at a certain point you'll likely have to replace some key components. The theory is that the cost of those repairs will be less than buying a whole new laptop though.

For me, it's looking to be a good choice. I enjoy hardware hacking/tinkering so, the 16 inch is going to be a great platform for me to tinker on (planning to extend the hinges and put a bunch of fun stuff on the top/kb area.

No.

For it to be a good investment it’s value would have to go up over time or drop at a slower rate than other comparable things.

A mac is a better investment (but still not “good”) not only because they tend to hold more value over time but the used market has higher volume so there’s less chance you need to price it low or wait a long time when you’re ready to sell.

If you’re worried about the value of being able to fix it, spend less than your $500 budget on a used t480 with the processor you want, upgrade the ram to 16, 32 or 64gb, install at least one ssd and be glad that there are literally millions of inexpensive spare parts on the market and will be for at least a decade.

What framework does uniquely offer is the ability to change your complement of ports. That’s either a useless novelty or a powerful tool depending entirely upon weather you consistently swap them out and can find all the ports you need as expansions or not.

Is it worth it to not be carrying around some dongle? I don’t know.

E: the processor to get on that t480 is one of the intels.

I've been happy with mine for a while. I've had some minor hiccups, but I blame myself for those because I choose to run arch on the thing. The swappable ports are a game changer for me, but that depends on the user.

When I bought it I didn't need a powerful laptop, but I may in a few years, so it made more sense to buy something for a bit more upfront. The upgradable mainboard is a crazy value add.

I've also been the unfortunate owner of multiple laptops that became unusable because of a broken part that was impossible to source for replacement.

For me it’s the only laptop that might entice me from leaving “the dark side” (Apple).

Would then install some Linux distro on it though.

Hi. If you want to look for a new laptop, you can also try out Tuxedo laptops: https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/Linux-Hardware/Linux-Notebooks/Alle.tuxedo

Their laptops are a bit cheaper and also repairable, starting from 850 EUR (8GB RAM, no Win license, etc.) They assemble laptops, you specify components to your needs.

I'm a happy owner of Tuxedo InfinityBook 15. The most important is that they use normal generic power supply (not some proprietary one that is hard to replace) with an ability to charge from 65+W USB-C connector. Battery preservation bypass mode is also possible in BIOS settings. Their keyboards are also high-quality, replaceable and can have a custom layout. The screen is also high-quality. Initial setup is easy af. They maintain their own distro, which is quite good on its own, but the hardware is also Win-compatible. They also provide 5% discount for students.

(note: not sponsored)

I seriously looked at them, but in the end, it was too expensive, especially over last years' models on sale- which were also very repairable. Not quite as much, but damn close, and with a dedicated GPU and better IO.

I like what they are doing, but they aren't quite there yet. The best long term investment IMO is a PC, since it can be easily upgraded independent of any one company. And the parts are much easier to trade, resell, etc.

Since no one asked... What are your use cases? Do you need a discrete GPU? Something lite? Something with lots of ports?

If you can afford it easily and used 500 bucks as a random number sure no problem, but othewise I don't think it a Framework is a good idea.

Is it really more modular than a ThinkPad or even professional Dell? I have an old Dell and finding replacement keyboard for it on ebay was cheap and easy. Same with battery. Changing keybaord/cpu/RAM is super easy, you can do it yourself. Bonus is that parts will be available for a very long time, there are many providers and surplus stock. Framework is nice but can you really be sure that in 5 years you will still be able to find parts easily?

Laptops are not long-term investments. Hardware innovation makes them obsolete almost as fast as phones. Whenever some new OS security feature comes out that depends on BIOS or chip capabilities then you need to swap motherboards (and often memory) which is the bulk of cost. Or when a new USB format comes out. Or whatever is the "flavor of the month" improvement in GPUs, Bluetooth connectivity etc. The only scenarios in which extensibility really makes sense would be SSD size, maybe battery or RAM. But if it costs double then you would be better off buying a new laptop now and then another in a few years, instead of paying up front for in order to "maybe" be able to swap some of the components later...