In-depth political discussion from around the world; if it's a political happening, you can post it here.
These guidelines will be enforced on a know-it-when-I-see-it basis.
Subcommunities on Beehaw:
This community's icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license.
Assuming innovation, it seems like there would still be a need for some way for producers to inform potential consumers. I'd love to see advertising move from "create demand" to "provide information". Not at all sure how that might come about though.
Meanwhile, I personally get by just fine with blocking as many ads as possible, which is almost all of them, and going out and searching when I need information. But that probably doesn't scale to busier people.
I agree, something like a verified product broadsheet that includes information about the product, but also provides information on where it is sourced and manufactured, who is doing the labor of production, where it can be serviced, how long its expected use... to provide the consumer fuller picture of utility.
This is a great question! I too have come to the realization that marketing is highly damaging to society. Commercials, ads, spam, flyers, etc. So much waste and invasion of privacy.
I've been trying to imagine what a world without marketing would look like for months.
In cetain areas, the consumer experience is greatly improved. No interruptions of TV or podcasts. Less bandwidth, ram, and cpu used when browsing web pages. No invasive individual tracking anywhere.
But the two major changes that require additional consideration:
How do businesses today that rely on ad revenue (web search, podcasts, etc) continue to exist and pay salaries and other expenses? A. These would all require a move to direct payment models. Either a usage fee or a subscription fee.
How do businesses source customers? Especially important for new businesses or new products that customers dont know about.
A. I dont have a clear solution here. But I would like to see two possible ways that are not mutually exclusive:
a. The Phone Book. It basically went extinct when the internet and web search became ubiquitous. But I'd like to see it return.
b. Service Brokers. Similar to above but businesses or humans in the loop to assist with supporting mapping of request to service provider.
With a., its pretty easy to make this physical, standardized and regulated to be fair/utilitarian
With b., it will require conscious effort to regulate and ensure consumers arent tracked and no business is given and unfair advantage.
How do businesses source customers? Especially important for new businesses or new products that customers dont know about.
Given the shift towards online shopping, the businesses can easily provide the necessary information along with the product they are selling. In that case, only those customer who are looking for a specific type of product get to see the information. Retains the necessary elements of advertising & marketing without the unnecessary element of consumerism.
- How do businesses today that rely on ad revenue (web search, podcasts, etc) continue to exist and pay salaries and other expenses? A. These would all require a move to direct payment models. Either a usage fee or a subscription fee.
On their own it would probably not work for everyone, but groups of paid services might work. Although I'm not sure how I would feel if everything started having a paywall...
Also I like both ideas. Would likely make consuming stuff more informative than persuasive.
Fully automated luxury gay space communism
Hi @bear_delune, we'd like to avoid these kinds of low-effort comments in !politics when possible. Please make an effort to contribute to the discussion more when commenting in the future.
Aye aye commander! 🫡
Out of curiosity, do you think Lemmy would benefit from letting users tag their own comments as shit posts and then let other users filter accordingly?
if we are talking 1950's futurism with gay being content and happy, count me in!
James Tiptree Jr. wrote a short story once called "The Girl Who Was Plugged In" set in a world where advertising was outlawed. The companies uses influencers to use their products in public, but they keep complete control of these influencers in the dark cyberpunk dystopian way.
A world without advertising and marketing is a world without persuasion. These two concepts by themselves were never the problem, as they're just a means to increase awareness and demand for a product or service. To me it seems that you instead take issue with a consumerist society.
Maybe, yeah. Not seeing everything through rose tinted glasses has made me realize how much I hate the current, greedy world. However I'm also very misinformed on other non-capitalist systems so I don't think I can contribute much to that at the moment.
I think our surroundings would be much cleaner. We'd have less flyers, billboards, tarps, etc. We would live in a quieter world filled with less distraction.
As much as I hate it however, I agree that it's a necessary evil, but maybe it could be executed more responsibly. I personally prefer "buy it for life" discussions, or product reviews by experts, or those gradings according to sustainability. So maybe in a non-capitalist society, adverts would be more informative than just, "look at this shiny thing, don't you want it?"
Or do we even need it?
i definitely get the sense that this is one of those things where there has to be an absolutist solution or none at all (at least without huge changes to the world and the incentives to perversely advertise). i don't know where you'd begin to draw a line on what is acceptable or unacceptable advertising--or in what venues--past "word of mouth is fine". to be honest, a lot of my shopping is already done by word of mouth because it's impossible to rely on anything else without getting made a rube, and that feels like a really good indication of where this'll all eventually decay.
Money is not evil - it's the love of money that crosses a line, pushing all other concerns to the side for the sake of that singular goal.
Advertising lets you know which products may be of interest to you, and "connects" you to places/things/products/whatever.
It's like fat on a person. You NEED some of it, and quite frankly the human species wouldn't survive without it (especially babies & milk), but we have managed to take a good thing and GROTESQUELY over-blow it, all out of proportion to what is needed. And then people push back, and some even go to the opposite extreme and become malnourished & bulimic.
TLDR: "All things in moderation".
I considered it a nessisary evil for a long time, then I released most purchases are unnecessary.
And that when you do need something, you go looking for it, searching the web, asking around, doing research, comparing options... Advertising just tries to make you skip all that, and not make a considered purchase.
Now that you say it, I don't think advertising has made an impact for what I want to buy in a long while(other than when announcing an unknown brand or when I already am looking for that product, and even then I don't think I have bought anything solely based on that).
Public bulletin boards are forbidden in, iirc, Brazil, or at least in the capital. Made for a very different view.
Same where I grew up in Alaska — no billboards, minimal advertising. The south was such a culture shock. )=
I'll just state some pros and cons of one hypothetical scenario in which there are virtually no advertisements. What defines an advertisement exactly may be up to date but I'll go with what I think.
Pros: Much more quiet with much less noise. Relations and connections and groups would be much tighter. There would still be heated discourse but it might be less polarized.
Cons: It would be harder to connect with people and services from farther away, because you mostly couldn't hear about them.
Isn't the price advertisers pay driven completely by the intermediaries (google and such) and advertising costs could continue to grow? Can't content producers unite (unionize) and get their piece?
I'm 100% against ads. I pay to not see them. I think advertisers would pay 10x for 👀 compared to what they currently pay.
If there were enforced laws for the marketing to be 100% truthful and non deceptive.
I personally hate advertising. Most companies that advertise are more expensive due to the cost of advertising being built into their prices.
I believe the metrics are made up to make companies think they're making money by spending money on it.
Better.