Young Europeans more likely to quit driving and have fewer children to save planet : futurology

[–] greenteadrinker@midwest.social 24 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I’m not European nor am I that young, but I share the same sentiment. Commuting by car isn’t good in a lot of aspects and kids are too expensive. Also having kids in this climate seems extremely stressful. Not only do you have to worry about extremely invasive tech, but you also have to worry about the changing climate and the (what seems like) global cost of living crisis

[–] rglullis@communick.news 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

1990: "wow, the ozone layer is getting destroyed. Who knows if we might have a planet. Might be better to not have kids"
1970: "wow, life is more expensive than ever and the world might end in a nuclear war. Might be better to not have kids"
1950: "wow, we just got out of the war and will need to rebuild the whole continent. Might be better to not have kids"
1800: "wow, I spend 15 hours a day working in a factory and I can barely sustain myself. Might be better to not have kids".
1400: "wow, I have back-breaking work in a farm and all of it goes to some king and I will never see. What is the point of this? Might be better to not have kids."

[–] inlandempire@jlai.lu 30 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Indeed, anyone can make up quotes about anything, without providing any substance to a discussion.

[–] rglullis@communick.news 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

If you need it spelled out for you, I'll help: life was never easy, but it never stopped people from stepping up to it and taking the responsibility for it. That includes having kids. Being "afraid of having kids" because of some external issue seems like a bad excuse from people who just don't want to accept the responsibility.

[–] vmaziman@lemm.ee 30 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Saying it’s our responsibility to have kids it’s implying it’s our responsibility to endlessly expand and multiply. That is the domain of viruses and creatures that exceed the environmental carrying capacity of their species

[–] rglullis@communick.news 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

it’s our responsibility to endlessly expand and multiply.

Not necessarily. We can still encourage people to have kids but keep it close to replacement rate (2.3 kids per woman)

[–] vmaziman@lemm.ee 12 points 1 year ago (1 children)

But isn’t it the fact that we have so many people coming into the middle class with middle class resource usage that causes planetary resource overruse? Either we need less people in the middle class, or 7 billion ppl have got to go back to pre industrial levels of consumption

[–] rglullis@communick.news 4 points 1 year ago

Either we need less people in the middle class, or 7 billion ppl have got to go back to pre industrial levels of consumption

No, we need less people living with the north american standard of consumption. This is not the same as "middle class".

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[–] RIPandTERROR@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

What a fucking stupid argument. How is it anyone's "responsibility" to have a kid? Please spell it out.

Here's my argument: it sounds hard and I don't wanna. Explain to me how I'm irresponsible. JFC 😂

[–] rglullis@communick.news 1 points 1 year ago

What is your plan when you get to old age?

[–] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

There are already way, way too many people on the planet.

[–] rglullis@communick.news 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And most of them are in Asia, old and about to die in 25 years or so.

[–] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The population on China and India is still growing. Have birth rates dropped below replacement levels?

[–] rglullis@communick.news 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

population on China and India is still growing.

China is already declining.

Have birth rates dropped below replacement levels?

Yes, India is already below replacement levels and dropping further.

[–] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Thanks for the sources. Interesting to see that "The number of new births a year has nearly halved since 2016" in China.

[–] rglullis@communick.news 1 points 1 year ago

That's what demographic collapse looks like. Birth rate drops a cliff because the population finds itself suddenly without people in fertile age.

[–] Konlanx@feddit.de 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

So what you're saying is this all could have been avoided if people had less children in the 1400s?

[–] rglullis@communick.news 1 points 1 year ago

"This all", good and bad, could/would happen anyway...

[–] v4ld1z@lemmy.zip 13 points 1 year ago

I've recently started an apprenticeship in Germany, and it's quite interesting to see how many people are super into getting children sometime down the line. I'm like, dude, we can't guarantee a proper future for ourselves - what future is there to be had for children lol

[–] kambusha@feddit.ch 12 points 1 year ago (5 children)

People who are empathetic, climate conscious, and can think critically SHOULD have kids. You'll make the future a better place. Imagine if only the people that don't give a shit have kids.

[–] uphillbothways@kbin.social 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Imagine having kids because of the things they should do to fix this place instead of because the world is wonderful and full of opportunity.

I wouldn't wish the future humanity has created on a stranger let alone my own flesh and blood. No thanks.

If we couldn't fix it, why make more people and lay that burden on them.

[–] andyMFK@reddthat.com 14 points 1 year ago

I can't imagine how much you'd have to hate your kids to place that burden on them

[–] riesendulli@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Doesn’t matter if you can’t afford live. Adopt a puppy.

[–] kambusha@feddit.ch 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Puppies can't vote, organise protests, develop technologies, or really do anything to help humans & the planet survive in the long-term. I love puppies but I don't get your statement in the context of this article and the survey.

[–] riesendulli@discuss.tchncs.de 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I didn’t comment the article. It’s in the same vein as saying somebody should have kids because they are empathetic. It’s not about votes or evolution but rather paying taxes, taking care of the old and so on. Since we are all getting older we need somebody to pay the bill. It’s depressing, but truth is I don’t need a car because I can’t afford it. I arranged my lifestyle to take public transports or a bike, because I can’t afford it. If I can’t afford a car, I probably can’t afford a bigger space for a family, and then the cost of raising a human, when i barely scrape by by myself. Get a better paying job - doesn’t work for everybody. Moving somewhere for another job - doesn’t work for everybody.

You can adopt children, which should be done if possible - there’s enough lost souls in the world.

See how climate change isn’t a factor for getting children? It’s all about them Benjamin’s

[–] kambusha@feddit.ch 1 points 1 year ago

You're not wrong. If one can't afford, then it's just not an option, and I agree it's probably not going to be good for anyone to have a kid in that scenario (whether making a baby or adopting).

That's not what the article is about though. Yes, technically it's not about empathetic people either, but in that case I've assumed that people who want to save the planet are likely to be empathetic (they think & care about their surroundings). I don't think that's too far-fetched.

If you were in a situation where things were affordable, would you get a car?

[–] Siddhartha-Aurelius@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It’s Idiocracy.

[–] kambusha@feddit.ch 1 points 1 year ago

It's what plants crave.

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[–] sadreality@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago

Small price to pay so that better people can fly on privater jets

[–] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

We are already having fewer children. This may cause more issues as the average age of a population will skyrocket

[–] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Better to have those issues than massive resource shortages that cause migration and war.

[–] LoamImprovement 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I mean, those are coming regardless. We were fucked twenty years ago and it has only gotten worse.

[–] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

Yes, they've already started, like in Syria, but we can and should mitigate and adapt instead of sticking our heads in the sand.

[–] Taringano@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago

In fact the Europeans not having kids will increase migratiom quite a lot.

Futurology