I realize most people who would visit 196 certainly know this, but I still feel compelled to point out that anarchism is entirely incompatible with capitalism.
this post was submitted on 09 Feb 2024
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Then explain why the chad in this meme is on the side of the capitalism
You can’t, and your argument lays in shambles
Then I'm left with no choice but to depict myself as the gigachad
I was hoping to avoid such extreme measures
I reneige
Is that how you spell that? Jesus I'm stupid
“Renege” is the correct spelling in english - I’m just bilingual and confused.
No, it's not (remove the i)
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Technically, anarchism is incompatible with communism, fascism, and socialism, as all of those require the state to exist in some way if undertaken at the national scale.
Anarcho-capitalism makes the most sense of them all. Just say you don't want a state to exist at all because you want to suck some robber baron/warlord's cock.
Which do you not understand: anarchism or communism? Communism is a stateless, classless society. It does not require a state, and it is perfectly compatible with anarchism. In fact, within any form of anarchism you'd find communism.
Anarchism is no state and no hierarchies. In any form, it seeks horizontality and mutual aid. It is absolutely unhinged to think that's compatible in any way with capitalism.
Jfc the media has really succeeded in deluding people about what anarchism is, haven't they? The surprising thing is I'd expect that on, say, Facebook or 4chan or Stormfront, but I thought 196 was more ... leftist
I thought 196 was more … leftist
Unfortunately once there are more than a few votes a post will reach /all, making it visible on all instances, and with that come.. the others.. lol
Good point. I always browse by new, so I forgot that that's a thing.
I guess that explains why posts seem to start with some productive discussion, but then tend to get derailed over time. It gets exhausting having to explain the very basics over and over again, but maybe I need more patience. I too grew up propagandized, and thankfully I've had some people help me learn.
Yeah, it can spiral downhill pretty quick, and it's often the same handful of people who go around doing their wilfully ignorant reactionary thing on every fucking post (and since we can see them on kbin - another group who lurk and downvote any marginally leftist comment without engaging, because gods forbid their bias gets challenged)..
Trying to help these people learn is great, but can only go so far as long as they aren't interested in knowing. The undecided lurkers though, those are the ones you hope are picking up your knowledge!
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Communism is a stateless, moneyless, classless society. In what way is that incompatible with anarchism, the ideology based on the elimination of heirarchy (the state)?
Modulo MLs defining state to mean "any method of organising a society" in which case not even anarchism is stateless because yes of course we're doing that. The common politological understanding of state is more or less along those lines, too. I propose to not get anything in any twists over definitions.
Anything is only incompatible with anarchism insofar as it inflicts hierarchical power. Certain stuff at least some people call communism most certainly falls under that umbrella (though even Lenin admitted it was state capitalism), others are compatible or at least very close. Classical council communism certainly looks awfully like anarcho-syndicalism.
That's assuming anarchists agree with Marx's definition of the state. Which, famously, they don't. It's far too nebulous to be useful for analysis, theory or prefigurarion. Marx isn't the end all be all of left wing politics. Here's a short video going into more depth on anarchist criticisms of the Marxist conception of the state.
To quote Malatesta "Anarchists, including this writer, have used the word State, and still do, to mean the sum total of the political, legislative, judiciary, military and financial institutions through which the management of their own affairs, the control over their personal behaviour, the responsibility for their personal safety, are taken away from the people and entrusted to others who, by usurpation or delegation, are vested with the powers to make the laws for everything and everybody, and to oblige the people to observe them, if need be, by the use of collective force."
If you're going to debate anarchist ideas, you should use anarchist definitions so at the very least you understand what you're criticizing.
Definitions matter and communism has been understood as a stateless, classless, moneyless society for as long as the term has existed. The only people who would contest that definition are either ignorant or anti-communist actors who have a vested interest in muddying the waters. And I don't think those individuals should have the final say on what is and isn't communism.
Lenin didn't practice or install a communist society, and as you've noted, he didn't intend to. Council communists and even libertarian marxists (Marxist autonomists for example) are both horizontal ideologies and despite some linguistic differences from anarchism, I consider them comrades. They can call it a state if they want, anarchists would disagree. But if the only difference between us and them is definitions, I don't really see an issue. That's something that can be debated post-revolution
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Tell me you know nothing about anarchism, communism, fascism, or socialism, without saying you know nothing about anarchism, communism, fascism, or socialism lol..
https://medium.com/international-workers-press/misconceptions-about-communism-2e366f1ef51f
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Has any online leftist ever talked to an ancap? It's not that they suppirt oppression outright, just that they don't care if it doesn't affect them. That's why their ideology makes sense: they don't consider that they'd be the proles, they'd be the capitalists.
Coincidentally, that's why most authoritarians support their brand of oppression: in their specific genre, they're the winners and the losers can go fuck themselves. And no, they don't consider that they're just paving the way to their ineviable overthrow
It’s not that they suppirt oppression outright, just that they don’t care if it doesn’t affect them
So they support oppression outright.
"If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor"
(never mind that they openly support capitalism, and capitalism by design and necessity is oppressive, so either way, you're not making the point you think you're making, or worse, are being not even neutral in the face of "an"caps ambitions of oppression, but actively arguing in its defence)
the point you think you’re making
There's a difference between wanting to opress people and wanting something that oppresses people for its other effects. The forner is unrelatable and outright evil, the latter is something most people do without even realizing it
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Their arguments don't make sense until they successfully redefine every term they use, like Anarchism, hierarchy, consent, and more.
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ancaps are just libertarians that live with their parents and libertarians are just republicans that like weed
Regarding the Chad as Anarcho-Capitalist convo: I think we maybe shouldn't credit value to character archetypes rather than to logic and principles.
No one's actually a complete Chad IRL. Some look the part. Some look the part and walk the walk some, but plenty are still true believers of white power. Some look the part but are really Gaston, or ready to go Joffrey at a moment's notice.
Others of us don't look Chad at all, and may look doomer, or sad girl (or whoever she is. Maybe Female Of The Species) and still have a point or legitimate grievance.
What others classify you as doesn't make you or your feelings less valid. These archetypes are observer's perspectives of instances. Moments. They're not a complete picture of what is happening.
And being or becomming Chad (or Neitzsche's ubermensch) is not in having perfect positions all the time, but being willing to err and learn from our mistakes. IRL, its a process, and even Christian nationalist Chad can learn, recover, and walk an enlightened path. Chad is a process. And 72% Chad is still pretty Chad.
Ancaps all live a main character fantasy where they'll be kings of the rubble.
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