UK Politics
General Discussion for politics in the UK.
Please don't post to both !uk_politics@feddit.uk and !unitedkingdom@feddit.uk .
Pick the most appropriate, and put it there.
Posts should be related to UK-centric politics, and should be either a link to a reputable news source for news, or a text post on this community.
Opinion pieces are also allowed, provided they are not misleading/misrepresented/drivel, and have proper sources.
If you think "reputable news source" needs some definition, by all means start a meta thread. (These things should be publicly discussed)
Posts should be manually submitted, not by bot. Link titles should not be editorialised.
Disappointing comments will generally be left to fester in ratio, outright horrible comments will be removed.
Message the mods if you feel something really should be removed, or if a user seems to have a pattern of awful comments.
!ukpolitics@lemm.ee appears to have vanished! We can still see cached content from this link, but goodbye I guess! :'(
view the rest of the comments
Labour aren't going to win without Brexit supporting Labour voters in the North. Keir knows this. He wants to win. Thus he's staying quiet on the Brexit issue.
The world has moved on from the divisions of 2016. The idea that Brexit was a bad idea is now pretty common outside the political bubble. Even among Leave voters, few think Brexit has been a success.
The economic reality of what Britain outside the EU looks like and the global geopolitical realignment that has happened since that day in 2016 - Russia's warmongering in our European neighbourhood and the very real prospect of a future Republican president (if not Trump this November, then someone else 4 or 8 years later) abandoning NATO - obviously should lead (and is leading) to people who voted for Brexit rethinking Britain's relationship with the EU.
And anyway - rejoining the Single Market wouldn't be undoing Brexit, it would just be doing literally what the Brexiters promised their voters they would do in the first place.
Starmer is being dramatically too cautious about the most impactful thing he could do to improve things in Britain.
Err sorry were you replying to me or OP?
I was replying to you (you were saying Starmer is staying quiet because he needs Brexit voters in the North).
I'm saying that if that's the case, he's thinking of the Brexit voters of 2016, not what these people think about things in 2024.
Oh all right, thanks.
Yeah I do think he's got an eye on that 2016 Labour Brexit vote. I also think that while the situation has changed with respect to Brexit, it clearly hasn't changed enough in the vote Labour camp to make the Labour leader change his position for this election. He's not stupid and would have done some serious polling and canvassing in the the Brexit Labour heartlands. Probably also wants to mop up some Tory votes as well.
Starmer needs to court the Brexit vote to get into power. Right now he's happy to do that of that means a win in the election. Wed Love him to be idealistic and say: enough with this nonsense let's rejoin. But he's being realistic. It needs a change in the Tory Brexit voting minds.... but first it needs a change in the Labour Brexit minds.
I don't think Starmer is stupid but I think Labour's large polling lead has - paradoxically - encouraged him to be very politically timid, to the detriment of his party and the country.
Broadly speaking the Labour leadership seems to be acting as if, if literally nothing changes between now and election day, then Labour will win a landslide. That means no genuine big new policy announcements, because any policy change is seen as a roll of the dice that could change the polling status quo. Rejoining the single market whilst staying outside the EU could be a popular policy - polling shows that even Labour Leave voters support it by a 53% to 31% margin - and would give an incoming Labour government an actual policy option to help turn around the economy, but Starmer's caution means forgoing this in favour of saying literally nothing novel. The Labour leadership think any change is a risk, and why take a risk when you're already sitting on a polling lead.
In general I'm favourable towards Starmer, and certainly in comparison to what came immediately before him. But on several issues - Europe, electoral reform, Gaza/Israel - he's adopting bad cautious positions to protect the enormous polling lead over the Tories he's stumbled into. These are going to end up doing him more harm than good in the long run.