this post was submitted on 02 Jul 2023
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censored? (infosec.pub)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by angrynomad@infosec.pub to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml
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I find it ironic on a free speech platform that access to a community about censorship is censored https://exploding-heads.com/c/censorship

What exactly is wrong with this instance to be defederated? In browsing it, I see nothing hateful

Or did they defederate from this instance, so you cant view/post on it. Not sure if I completely understand how that works yet

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[–] cypherpunks@lemmy.ml 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

The Lemmy software is intended to be somewhat censorship resistant, but that does not mean that lemmy.ml is a "free speech platform".

Like most instances, lemmy.ml has rules (they're in the sidebar on the front page) and we regularly delete posts and comments which violate them.

That instance you're talking about is intended to be a "free speech platform", which in modern internet parlance is a synonym for "nazi bar". One of the two admins of that instance says explicitly: “racism, bigotry, sexism is allowed".

Most Lemmy users don't want to see that kind of content, so, most Lemmy instances have defederated them.

I hope this answers your question!

[–] angrynomad@infosec.pub 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

So essentially it's highly censored to defederate them. Not only you can't view them using a different instance and post, but registering there, you can only interact with their instance. Lemmy needs a better method. I was thinking about this the other day, why is something as simple as blocking content on the users end or blocking x type of content not an option, even on registration. Even if there's hate speech mixed in, freedom of speech should exist, but freedom to not hear it, should also exist. Essentially shadow banning, but done by choice of those who don't want to hear said content.

I really don't think Lemmy will survive as everyone will be afraid of getting cancelled and defederated.

[–] bear_delune 3 points 1 year ago

Defederation isn’t censorship.

If you want to be involved in that community, you’re free to go and do that.

No instance is required to associate with any other and the choice not to associate isn’t suppression of speech.

The choice to not associate; is speech, speech that is perfectly valid.

[–] jerkface@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

An environment where anyone can spin up an instance where they control member accounts and then post on other instances with impunity would obviously be an unusable hellscape of griefing and abuse. The only, ONLY, ONLY way a community can survive in these conditions is if they have power to censor the content that they syndicate. Indeed, that is the whole point of community groups vs just consuming raw Internet; the content has been curated (aka censored) according to some set of rules.

There are pure P2P networks that function the way you want. Go take a look and discover why no one is there.

[–] angrynomad@infosec.pub 0 points 1 year ago

Freenet still seems to be around. As I posted in my other comment here, I think Lemmy needs a client side censorship instead, giving users the option to hide what they don't want. Eventually this will become a mess of instances doing anything to prevent getting canceled, thus increasing censorship.

[–] Anonymoose@infosec.pub 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm new here myself but as I understand it, defederation essentially separates that instance from the rest of the "lemmy-verse" by not allowing users created on that instance to interact and post to other lemmy instances.

You can still go to exploding heads and create a user there to post within that space. That user just won't be able to interact with other lemmy instances that don't federate to it. Maybe it's less censorship and more of a refusal to associate with certain content.

Someone more knowledgeable please feel free to correct any errors, lol.

[–] angrynomad@infosec.pub 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I tried going to https://infosec.pub/c/censorship@exploding-heads.com and it was empty except one post. shortly after I posted this it looked like their whole instance went offline though. something is glitching, sometimes I can see all the posts when reloading, but usually not

[–] Anonymoose@infosec.pub 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Additionally, since your account is lemmy.ml , you need to creating an account on exploding heads to interact and post new content to that censorship community ( I THINK ), since they no longer federate.

[–] angrynomad@infosec.pub 1 points 1 year ago

I'm on infosec.pub because I couldn't get registration working anywhere. I really don't think Lemmy will survive because of how convoluted it is.

I don't want to have to maintain multiple accounts or figure out how to get to the exploding heads url. A normal user just wants one account to "just work".

Hell, I can never even remember my own instances url

See my other post in this thread https://infosec.pub/comment/488302

Seeing the linking url I'm even more confused to this, I thought I posted on asklemny@lemmy.ml, so everything I post really is tied to my origin instance

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