this post was submitted on 26 Jun 2023
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I'm so conflicted on this. On the one hand he seems like a giant asshole that saves on safety to make a few more bucks but on the other hand he trusted his system completely and died with it. So not really greedy asshole but stupid entrepreneur who didn't realize how wrong he was?
The word is arrogant.
Hubristic, delusional.
Both. The drive to be a cheap pos caused him to believe he knew more than he did.
A greedy asshole who thought himself a genius?
It's one thing if he died alone and another when he took other 4 people with him. I would still chalk it up to greedy asshole, because he cheap out things that would've saved the four people.
The fact he started charging after several warnings from Industry players does raise the asshole angle
I guess society needs people like him that make crazy things. Science itself is pretty much like this, trying out stuff and be creative. People often made inventions while other people were telling them that it would be impossible to do so.
However, I think where he actually behaved really like an asshole was taking people with him who he made believe to be in a safe vessel. He could have made a disclaimer saying something like "this is an experimental vessel, I'm not sure if it will hold up and people have warned me. I still want to take the risk and you can come, too, if you are willing to take the same risk."
Thing is, as James Cameron pointed out in his interviews, this is not a cutting-edge field. The science of submersibles is well explored and the technologies are mature. Engineers know exactly how to construct a safe submersible to go as deep as you want. There are companies like this that make and sell these submersibles.
This guy was not doing research or experimentation. He was trying to cut costs because he probably couldn't afford a proper submersible under his business model and still make a profit. The only reason for using unconventional materials - materials that are well known to be unsuitable for this purpose - was that he thought he could do it more cheaply if he didn't go through safety certification or buy a sub that had already been certified. The point was to spend less money by taking more risks and make a profit. He was not innovating, and he was arrogantly overconfident, to the point of overriding all the experts who had warned him this would get people killed.
how did a filmmaker suddenly became expert in a field that is not filmmaking? if you want to make argument by authority, at least pick real authority ;)
I thought that too at first, but he is actually an experienced diver who has repeatedly visited the bottom of the ocean, including a solo dive to the deepest point in the world. He does seem to know what he is talking about.
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/article/120325-james-cameron-mariana-trench-challenger-deepest-returns-science-sub
interesting, i had no idea, i thought that his perceived expertise is devised from making titanic. thank you for the link.
Taking risks for the sake of innovation, fine, I guess it has to be done to move forward. However, building a submersible that can go to these depths is nothing new. Been there, done that, basically. To throw all lessons learnt with previous vehicles out with the garbage is just monumentally stupid.
Engineers and scientists do try to do and make crazy things but they try to do it safely, and doing it safely costs money which he didn't want to spend.
I guess the most positive spin is that he risked and gave his life to try new things which can progress things more quickly, but he didn't just risk his own life, he risked the passengers which is unforgivable. If he were doing it solo to not endanger others then I could respect that.
I agree with you. It kind of itches me that he was just so ignorant of already established knowledge. But then, this is exactly the point where we fall blind to alternative solutions because we are limited by our prior established rules. So I didn't want to judge, but yes he seemed to be very ignorant.
I would respect it for some team doing something as risky, that's what I wanted to express. That he took paying customers was unethical imo.
I’d bet they signed release forms which said pretty much exactly that.
"oh yeah, you have to sign this, our insurance company forces us to do this, but don't worry, it is just a formality"
these people were not qualified to asses the risk and trusted the person who pesented himself like an expert. tricking them to sign a paper doesn't make his actions less unethical.
absolutely not. he wasn't some creative pioneer exploring the unknown. he was a moron that operated in the environment that is known and explored in great detail and just decided to cut on the costs by ignoring all the best practices.
I don't disagree and people repeatedly pointed this out to me here. I just gave him the benefit of the doubt to being maybe more chaotic/creative then he probably was.
A greedy asshole who thought himself a genius?
His company wasn’t even profitable, he wasn’t making money