Rheios

joined 1 year ago
[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

That's fair. Neither is the Tarrasque.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 4 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (2 children)

How do they manage an average of 679 damage?

First Aerial bombardment rules would probably give the Tarrasque a DC 15 Reflex save for half damage for each. Assuming it was a surprise at first the Tarrasque probably doesn't get this so I'll ignore it.

Second, a Giant owl's likely only weigh like 140lbs by loose calculation, being a little over 4x the height of a snowy owl (so assuming 4 times equivalent weight and then cubed is 64kg which approximately equals 141lbs. It could be a little higher but its not breaking 200lbs) and requiring falling at least 20ft before they even start ranking damage by the srd 3.5 rules for items falling on players (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/environment.htm). Assuming you meant 40ft over the Tarrasque, and allowing for 1d6 damage every 10ft past the point instead of the 20ft that's implied to be required, the owls would deal 2d6 damage each at that height, requiring 20ft of falling to start incurring damage. Even without it that's not 679 damage.

That's pretty much 0 damage too, because 2d6 per owl - subtract the DR 15 of the tarrasque from each instance of damage - is 0 damage. Iirc there was a min 1 damage even for negative strength modifiers but DR superseded that. Even if I'm wrong that's 1 damage per owl max.

Even if you went the 220ft up above the Tarrasque you'd need to hit maximum fall speed under the more polite 1d6/10ft rules, after falling 20ft, you'd end up with 20d6 each, the cap for fall damage. Which after DR is 440 damage.560 damage without DR.

Which actually isn't that high up. I thought the Tarrasque was taller than 50ft, but its still a hell of a timed shot tbh. It assumes the Tarrasque doesn't move for like 6 or 7 rounds, or moves in a straight line into the falling birds.

That doesn't' fix the weakness of a Tarrasque to some form of high impact drop damage, necessarily, just means that I'm suspicious the birds can pull it off.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

My players shall curse you for the fun you'll have given me on their next trek out of the city. I'm think Yeth hound stats but I'm flexible atm. Maybe a shadow.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Have him stab the mayor who's evil because he's greedy and selfish and borderline abusive in trade-deals with neighboring regions but is otherwise beloved (and has rewards heaped on him) because he's so good at actually keeping order in the town and keeping their goodwill (although probably at least a little bit through some passive-aggressive blackmail). That's always fun.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

No argument save that all of that shouldn't make you exemplary or unique in the way the rules present. It makes you motivated. Frankly even class levels shouldn't make you special because everyone should have them. (The NPC classes of 3.5 fell into this trap to for the Warrior and Adept, imo.)*

Johnny Haysee who had some training in the town guard only to lose his family when his village was murdered by a sudden zombie incursion, who then goes on a vengeance fueled life of adventure to gain the power to fight the necromancer that created them isn't any less of a Johnny Hayseed who signed up for basic training, washed out, and then decided to go adventuring. Either can fight but no better than any other guard at lvl 1, because all lvl 1 guards should be fighters (or some other class, not to go too deep down the rabbit hole of "what classes should have what skills in what jobs"). What makes the Adventurer special is their motivation, but their motivation shouldn't start them with super-powers. It should deliver those to them as they explore the world, themselves, and their abilities.

(*) I guess you could define class levels as adventurer only, but even then at lvl 1 I'm not sure you're "better" enough to qualify as meaningful, and in 5e at least its irrelevant because the divorced system between opponents - even npcs - and players means its all nonsensical to justify anyway because the town guard there isn't a Fighter lvl 5 by the rules its a Monster labeled Fighter and will be stated according to what would be a challenge for the DM's needs. Which demands a lot of world based hand waving but that's not what the conversation was on.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Or a one note one. But, while I like monstrous races as options, I dislike the trend of 5e to make our characters "special", unique, or noteworthy before the adventuring even begins. (If this is duplicated for some reason, I'm sorry. It tried editing and that didnt' seem to take, then I tried deleting my original message and reposting. Not sure what's up.)

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 2 points 1 year ago

I need to watch that, I've heard good things but have never seen it.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I can't think of any media that explores its magic at any level where that isn't true though, tbh.

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Yes and no.

If he'd gotten powers from the divine oath-giver he'd be a Warlock or Cleric, dependent upon the nature of their relationship and the being's powers.

If he got the powers himself from his absolute rigid dedication to his oath, then he'd be a 5e Paladin (I prefer "Dedicant" or "Crusader" for which Paladin should be a specific Oath but that's a different conversation).

Otherwise in older editions he'd probably just be a devout warrior.

For those older editions he'd only be a Paladin if the oath he held to was far more specific and arguably he and several of the other hobbits were a bit too quick and dirty for. Particularly during the era of Racial restrictions to classes which didn't allow halfling Paladins. (Assuming halflings to hobbits is 1:1 in all settings, which is far less consistent over time.)

For how a generous DM might work around that in older editions sometimes, I'd look to BG2's Mazzy Fentan: https://baldursgate.fandom.com/wiki/Mazzy_Fentan

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 1 points 1 year ago

...I miss when Time Stop let you cast attack spells...

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Have you considered an anti-magic field area of considerable size? That's hardly a good continual response but it may allow a more challenging encounter, especially if the field can be briefly turned off by characters expending spell slots into a single dangerous spot while being attacked. Since it prevents Divine smites and the bonuses. (Someone could 5e-argue that probably, since its pretty nonsensical with class abilities at times but I'd just overrule it.) You can even use it with Mindflayers or other psionic aberrations, since arguably their abilities can still work if you rule they can. (Psionics don't necessarily equal magic unless you set some other precedent.)

Other concepts are to add hazards and chaos causers to battlefields. Floating clouds of glittering fog that reflect spells to random other targets, negative-energy/undead quicksand bogs that leech endurance instead of doing damage (and whose saves are to avoid getting stuck not to avoid the drain), unsteady floors to drop out and separate parts of the party, or lair effects that randomly teleport characters back to earlier areas of a dungeon, forcing them to run back through to get back into the fight (don't overuse that one but if there are traps earlier its a great way to force them to ignore traps in their rush).

Also just tasks to do while being attacked. The paladins + cleric can defend well together but force them to be separated into different regions doing a task and you up the tension (even if you don't up the danger).

You can also try bringing forward older monsters that undercut benefits/items. Black Puddings, Rust Monsters (Or their papa Annihilators), or port over other monsters like Magerippers or Spellweavers from 3.5.

Traps can also be good, since they may be taking 1/4 damage on a save, but if the traps also cause inconveniences or force them through alternate, and slowly more damaging paths (like crawling through a stone brambled tunnel instead of taking the other tunnel because it caved in and almost crushed them), they can still build up and be valuable.

Also if they're incredibly proficient in combat, the enemies probably know that by this level. So you might have to start attacking them legally or socially, depending on the situation. Or just start having foes avoid them. Make them burn resources to set up engagements where foes can't run or attack them when they're on their back foot relaxing with assassins in the bathrooms, poisons in the bar bread, false accusers of horrible crimes on the streets and in court. (Depending on who their foes are of course.) You do that so that their character get paranoid. Start trading things like spell slots, the benefits of sleep, or close allies to try and defend themselves, so that they're weakened before they even touch something like a dungeon. If they party is just too invincible in combat as it is, don't just attack them there, let them know that existence is sortof a threat. (And as before, how much you use it is important an should be informed by session 0. You want them tense and excited, not miserable, and "the world as the DM's weapon" isn't necessarily the right way to approach it but its a nice tool to have in the chest. Hammer finds nail and all that.)

[–] Rheios@ttrpg.network 1 points 1 year ago

Nah, I loved changing out those disks. Core memory nostalgia material right there. Waste of time for sure, but one I remember fondly in hindsight.

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