I reject the premise that right-wingers can be anarchists. I don’t care what they call themselves. Anarchism is a left-wing movement, fundamentally.
this post was submitted on 09 Aug 2024
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anarcho-capitalism is actually corporate fascism
A bit debatable on the individual level but that’s likely what it would lead to. Some ancaps are weirdly anti-corporate though. They think somehow big powerful corporations were created by the state. Which is true in some cases but clearly not in others.
If they didn't blatantly steal ideas from the left and twist it to support rich people, where would they get ideas? Have you stopped and considered how mentally bankrupt they are?
Literally I think I've seen a handful or fewer conservative memes that weren't just a shitty spin on a leftists meme.
Yes, and I think that’s the joke here.
Kind of seems like that’s what they’re getting at but I find this linguistic deception so irritating that I can’t even tolerate the implicit suggestion here that the top dude might be some kind of anarchist.
Back The Blue supporters jamming to Rage against the Machine for decades then suddenly getting upset at the band.
Having "less government" eventually crosses a threshold into having "no functional macro government at all".
What you do after that threshold is entirely open ended.
Anarchism is not owned by one political group, the ideation of what comes next is. (In leftist groups, collectivism via willful participation, focused on meeting the needs of all members of the group. In right groups, what amounts to libertarian bartering and more insular communing.)
Anarchism is about opposition to all oppression and unjust hierarchies. If you are pro-capitalism, pro-patriarchy, pro-white supremacy, or pro-nationalism, you aren’t an anarchist. Sorry.
And if you aren’t any of those things, what affinity do you have with the political right?
Are you asking me? Or being hypothetical?I'm none of those things, nor an anarchist, I'm just capable of reading the definition .
If that was directed at me, Kinda shitty you assumed that about me as i made a complete abstract statement, without showing my favor.
- a state of disorder due to absence or nonrecognition of authority or other controlling systems.
the organization of society on the basis of voluntary cooperation, without political institutions or hierarchical government; anarchism.
My previous comment aligns, especially with the second definition.
Many, many on the right want far less government and less of anyone telling them how to organize their communities. they absolutely want a new version of the world with small and increasingly absent governance. The fact that they are shitty doesn't discount their desire for anarchist changes in macro governance.
Frankly, your descriptions of what you believe "true" anarchism proves my point. A right aligned person could come in and confidently describe their key points as they believe just as well.
MY core point was that it's the transition to micro governance, free of external systemic pressure is not isolated to leftist ideals, edit though, it could be! In your post collapse world.
Chill, it’s just a rhetorical you, directed at any who identify with it. If you don’t, then that’s fine. I know nothing about your ideology.
Anarchism is unique to the left though. I’ve never met someone in the right who doesn’t subscribe to some kind of hierarchical domination of other people, usually one of multiple of the examples I gave. If they don’t, then in my view they are confused about their own ideological position.
If you destroy some hierarchies and not others, the systems newly freed from competition for dominance in society will rapidly expand and replace them. Anarchism has always been about opposition to capitalism as much as to the state. You can’t just abandon one of the core tenets and still claim to belong—although the first ancaps were never anarchists. They were capitalists who discovered a clever and dishonest way to advocate for their own dominance over society.
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Having “less government” eventually crosses a threshold into having “no functional macro government at all”.
What you do after that threshold is entirely open ended.
I think that is where you leave what anarchists define as anarchism. It doesn't end there, it's not open ended. If you end up with some town or camp that is ruled by a leader and/or a priesthood and police force to keep law and order, it's not anarchism. If you can own land and impose your vast property rights so others don't have anything, you're not anarchist.
Exactly how a voluntary collaboration of anarchists is supposed to work to avoid quickly growing small systems of power again (chiefs or warlords) I never figured out so don't ask me. Best answer is that "because the people already overthrew the existing power structures they will have an easier time preventing future power structures". So I think they assume the belief system is powerful enough so that once people are indoctrinated, they would reject any systems of control again. How such an indoctrination is achieved and maintained would be my next question.
Of course there are theories like anarcho-syndicalism. And I think in generally anarchism is understood as merely being of a mindset that any authority has to justify itself or be abolished, but necessary authority is not. So you'd still pay taxes for roads and schools.
more ramblings
Personally I believe that without AGI and a powerful and benevolent and incorruptable mind a la "The Culture" any ideology is just window dressing and temporary. If humanity wants someone to watch the watchers, we need to build the perfect watcher that can do that.
How is it fundamentally a left wing movement? I like lib left ideals, but fundamentally speaking, How can you have centralized economic planning as well as anarchism?
Left-wing does not necessarily imply a centralized or planned economy.
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Jesse plemons was awesome in this scene, but I'm not sure if the character is someone leftist anarchists want to model themselves after lol
I was surprised by how much I enjoyed that movie.
One of the best movies I've seen in a long time! Great acting, music, writing, costumes, concept, locations. Proper cinematic experience!
Have been trying to figure out what movie it is. Can you give me a tip?
Civil War
Thanks! For some reason (and I admit I was barely paying attention when it was released) I had the impression it was to some degree a right-wing propaganda film. I'm guessing if it's being memed here it's probably not. 🙂
Will check it out!
I expected it to be a lot more political in focus but it is straight up a movie about war. The grim, the mundane, the absurd and the horror of war. I think the closest inspiration I would say is Apocalypse Now.
Sounds interesting in any case, thank you!
AnCaps are basically Anarchism minus the political theory (aka all the core fundemental values of Anarchism) and with too much economic theory from Murray Rothbard ("free market" capitalism). The best thing I can say about them is that most of them grow out of it and choose an actual version of Anarchism as soon as they're exposed to theory (at least I did and now I'm an AnSynd).
Great that you made the turnaround, but what you describe is only true for the many confused online ancaps that usually ended up there through the bitcoin pyramid scheme propaganda pipeline.
There is a different group often condidered to have been started by Murray Rothbard that have a well defined ideological basis for which they try to appropriate terms like "Libertarian" and "Anarchist" but which has nothing to do with the original meaning of these words. This group is well funded by oligarchs and serves as the ideological think-tank to justify the massive theft of these very same oligarchs.
These justifications are in turn often uncritically lapped up by the first group.
I'm referring to the ignorant people who blindly follow the capitalists because that's most "An"caps and right "libertarians". Many people like myself fell down the pipeline when we realized that the government is fundementally a source of evil and the ideal society is one based on mutual cooperation rather than coercion. The problem therefore is that "An"caps have only figured out half of the problem, they understand the evils of government but not the coercive power of the capitalist class. The group you described can be simply referred to as the capitalist class as they hold no true morals or political ideology.
Ah yes, the horseshoe theory.
We all remember who the nice guy is
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